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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hoping someone could help me out with an issue I'm having with my 2019 Kawasaki ZX636. I have an Akrapovic Racing Exhaust System and a K&N High Flow Air Filter (KA-6009) currently installed with a Power Commander 5 and Auto Tuner. There are no preset tunes available on the Dynojet website for this specific setup. I spoke with a Dynojet rep back in 2019 about it and they recommended one of the available tunes that would work (I can't remember which one, and my old laptop is dead).

The main issue I've had with the current tuning is when I shift from neutral to 1st gear after the engine has warmed and has been idle for a bit, the engine will stall unless you slightly blip the throttle. I'd imagine there should be a better tune available, or maybe someone else out there has the same setup and has tweaked some of the low end/idle specs a bit for an available tune. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
 

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That sounds more like a clutch that's not adjusted right and it's partially engaged even with the lever pulled in. The tune shouldn't have an effect on that or else it would do it in neutral too. The fuel and ignition tables are based on RPM regardless of what gear you're in. Unless they were changed per individual gear, which I don't think it's even possible with Dynojet, and even if it was I highly doubt anyone would've taken the time to actually do that. Most generic tunes are done by unified gearing, meaning the fuel and ignition tables will be the same regardless of what gear you're in.

Put the bike up on the rear stand, turn it on while in neutral, then pull the clutch lever in and shift it into 1st. If the wheel starts spinning pretty fast and you still have the clutch lever all the way in, then that's your problem. At that point you can also press the rear brake to stop the wheel from spinning. If the engine stalls that means it's way out of adjustment.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I don't think that's the issue, although the idle speed does seem to be a little low. My bike has been sitting in the garage for several months unridden since I was recovering from a major surgery for several months last year. 2 things I just noticed while inspecting the bike are that the idle speed seems slightly low and the clutch lever seems a bit off, so I think sbk1198 may be right about the clutch lever needing to be adjusted, although I'll most likely bump my idle speed up a bit while I'm at it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
That sounds more like a clutch that's not adjusted right and it's partially engaged even with the lever pulled in. The tune shouldn't have an effect on that or else it would do it in neutral too. The fuel and ignition tables are based on RPM regardless of what gear you're in. Unless they were changed per individual gear, which I don't think it's even possible with Dynojet, and even if it was I highly doubt anyone would've taken the time to actually do that. Most generic tunes are done by unified gearing, meaning the fuel and ignition tables will be the same regardless of what gear you're in.

Put the bike up on the rear stand, turn it on while in neutral, then pull the clutch lever in and shift it into 1st. If the wheel starts spinning pretty fast and you still have the clutch lever all the way in, then that's your problem. At that point you can also press the rear brake to stop the wheel from spinning. If the engine stalls that means it's way out of adjustment.
I think you're right. I just completely glossed over the simple solutions, assuming the issue was something a bit more complex, like adjusting my PC5 idle afr setpoints. I felt the clutch lever after reading your comment and it does feel a little off, as if it's slightly disengaged even when fully pressed. Too bad it's nearly 1am and I can't start the bike up. It's loud as hell with the Akrapovic Exhaust, so the wife might lose her shit if I wake her up on a work night lol. Once the wife wakes up, I'll prop her up on the rear axle and test her clutch lever. I do still plan to adjust a few of the low rpm idle afr settings and bump my idle rpm up just a bit as well. Although it may not be what's causing this specific issue, idle rpm does seem a bit lower than I remember the last time I was able to ride, and I think bumping idle afr up a bit will give me a smoother idle as well. Thanks for the advice!
 

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It may also be stale fuel, unless you had stabilzer and a completely full tank before surgery.

These things are also known to wear out the throw out rod inside the clutch cover. When that starts to fail the free play starts to ‘move’ and you have to take up slack at the lever, compared to increasing slack as the plates wear.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
It may also be stale fuel, unless you had stabilzer and a completely full tank before surgery.

These things are also known to wear out the throw out rod inside the clutch cover. When that starts to fail the free play starts to ‘move’ and you have to take up slack at the lever, compared to increasing slack as the plates wear.
Definitely not stale fuel. I just pulled her out of storage about 2 months ago after draining the fuel tank and filling her up with fresh fuel. Maybe a bit overkill, but I actually removed the tank, drained it, added a small amount of the fresh fuel, swished it around and drained it again before refueling. I think you both hit the nail right on the head in regard to the clutch lever. After inspecting it, it does seem like I need to take up some slack at the lever.

This is my first time asking any sort of question on a forum like this. You guys have both been helpful and I appreciate it. Still can't believe I glossed right over the simple solutions and jumped straight to idle afr settings adjustments as my potential solution. Makes me feel like I've gotten a bit rusty since I haven't mechanic'd in quite a while lol.
 

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Occam’s razor should always be applied in troubleshooting.

That, plus the sure and certain knowledge that we’re more likely to make it worse, leading to “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it”
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Occam’s razor should always be applied in troubleshooting.
Occam’s razor should always be applied in troubleshooting.

That, plus the sure and certain knowledge that we’re more likely to make it worse, leading to “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it”
True, and your first line is quote worthy. Trying to figure out how to add a default quote to my messages now lol.
 

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The lever the clutch cable connects to at the case, rotates its' shaft which has a claw on the opposite end. That operates against a pull out rod on the pressure plate, to expand the clutch pack to disengage the clutch. The claw end of the rod, wears away at the tip of the pull out rod, thinning it down over time until it starts to deform and eventually breaks.

As it goes through that thinning process and begins to deform, you get that weird 'I need to take up slack' and you cannot adjust out the partial engagement of the clutch.

The correct range of motion for the observable part of the shaft acting on the throw out rod (external to the clutch cover) is around 50° of rotation, stating from fully engaged with the point the cable connects to pointing directly inboard at the engine/clutch cover. The cable is supposed to pull that lever 'forward' through that 50° to disengage the clutch.

another way of saying that is if you are sitting on the bike looking down at that lever with 0° being towards the nose of the bike, the lever should start at about 270, and move to ~ 320.
 

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I think you're right. I just completely glossed over the simple solutions, assuming the issue was something a bit more complex, like adjusting my PC5 idle afr setpoints. I felt the clutch lever after reading your comment and it does feel a little off, as if it's slightly disengaged even when fully pressed. Too bad it's nearly 1am and I can't start the bike up. It's loud as hell with the Akrapovic Exhaust, so the wife might lose her shit if I wake her up on a work night lol. Once the wife wakes up, I'll prop her up on the rear axle and test her clutch lever. I do still plan to adjust a few of the low rpm idle afr settings and bump my idle rpm up just a bit as well. Although it may not be what's causing this specific issue, idle rpm does seem a bit lower than I remember the last time I was able to ride, and I think bumping idle afr up a bit will give me a smoother idle as well. Thanks for the advice!
What was your idle rpm at once it's warmed up? I don't remember what it's supposed to be stock, but anything between 1300 and 2000 should be fine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
The lever the clutch cable connects to at the case, rotates its' shaft which has a claw on the opposite end. That operates against a pull out rod on the pressure plate, to expand the clutch pack to disengage the clutch. The claw end of the rod, wears away at the tip of the pull out rod, thinning it down over time until it starts to deform and eventually breaks.

As it goes through that thinning process and begins to deform, you get that weird 'I need to take up slack' and you cannot adjust out the partial engagement of the clutch.

The correct range of motion for the observable part of the shaft acting on the throw out rod (external to the clutch cover) is around 50° of rotation, stating from fully engaged with the point the cable connects to pointing directly inboard at the engine/clutch cover. The cable is supposed to pull that lever 'forward' through that 50° to disengage the clutch.

another way of saying that is if you are sitting on the bike looking down at that lever with 0° being towards the nose of the bike, the lever should start at about 270, and move to ~ 320.
Well, I haven't ridden the bike near enough at this point to really wear anything out. I did put the back wheel up on my jack and test the clutch lever though. While in neutral the rear wheel would move slowly, so I tightened the clutch cable a bit, which fixed that issue, but I still had the issue with the bike stalling once I shifted to 1st gear. I went ahead and bumped idle rpm up to about 1950 and adjusted my idle/0% throttle target afr a bit closer to stoich. Once I made those adjustments, the issue went away, she seemed to run quite a bit smoother in general and a previous issue I had with some minor backfire at lower throttle % was resolved as well. The only thing that makes sense to me is that prior to my adjustments, she was just running too rich at idle, which would cause her to bog down and stall the second there was any load on her once shifted to 1st gear. Now that I've been reading quite a bit more into Power Commander Tuning with the Autotuner, I've realized that I have some adjustments to make in the lower end of my fuel map. Seems a bit odd that I would have to do that because Dynojet doesn't provide any inputs for Idle/0% or 5% throttle target afr values in their provided fuel maps. I've read that Dynojet tech reps recommend not putting any inputs in the 0% or 5% throttle columns, but the second I make minor adjustments in the 0% throttle column, my bike runs smoother at idle into 1st gear, and I no longer have any issues with the bike wanting to stall when shifting to 1st.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
What was your idle rpm at once it's warmed up? I don't remember what it's supposed to be stock, but anything between 1300 and 2000 should be fine.
Idle rpm was initially around 1500. Once I bumped it up to 1950 rpm and adjusted my idle/0% throttle target afr a bit closer to stoich, I no longer had any issues with the bike stalling when shifting to 1st gear.
 
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