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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys,

As some of you remember, I won a Lionheart Moto suit raffle last year.

http://zx6r.com/off-topic/57083-raffle-lionheart-moto-custom-suit.html


Unfortunately, I have yet to receive it and am looking for answers.

I will explain the events leading up to this. I'll try to remain level-headed and neutral when it comes to explaining the facts.

I ask those that respond to keep it mature and refrain from name-calling. Everyone has their side of the story.

I will be linking him this thread so he can defend himself fairly.

I removed some of the names since they did not want to be involved. I also removed Scott's email address as well.


Below is a rundown of our conversations. I can provide copies of this as well to prove their legitimacy.

7/10/15 - I won the raffle on my birthday 7/10/14 and messaged Scott on Facebook. He told me where to send the measurements etc. We agreed to email instead of FB message. I sent him an email from my email to verify it was me and we exchanged roughly 6 emails about design and options.

7/11/15 - Emailed me to let me know they're working on the design and it should be ready on Monday (2 days) because the factory manager's Mother had passed.

I reply back its not an issue.


7/22/15 - I send my measurements.

7/24/15 - I email asking if he got the measurements. He replies back he got them and are working on it now.

8/12/15 - I inquired about a design change. Scott said I can change it as much as I'd like but the factory is running slow. No reason given.

8/18/15 - I sent a design. Scott emails me back saying he sent it in. I revised it the same day and email him.


8/19/15 - Scott sends in revised design.

9/21/15 - Scott sends me a mock-up of the suit. Looks good.

9/25/15 - Added a design on one of the stretch panels.

11/7/15 - I emailed Scott for an update since I hadn't received the suit. Scott tells me "it won't be much longer" and assures me that despite the sale of his company, the suit will still be sent without any issues.

12/20/15 - I email Scott asking for an ETA since the season should be starting soon. Scott tells me he'll update me on Monday.

12/22/15 - (Monday) No reply.

1/2/15 - (2 weeks later) I email him asking for an ETA....no response.

1/5/15 - I resend my email asking again for an ETA. No response.



The following will be posted verbatim so there will be no confusion.

1/7/15 - I'm fed up at this point since he usually emails me back within a few hours since he sends emails from his phone. I try to contact him on Facebook but I had been blocked.

I wrote:

"Scott,

This will be the last email I sent you as I am literally tired of following up.

I now realize I probably will never get the suit promised to me due to poor communication and the fact that I have been waiting for months for a half way decent response. I don't know if you're just waiting on me to lose interest in the suit or what but it should not take this long.

I think its unfair that you took everyone's money and will not come up with your end of the deal. I will find a way to legally recoup the money as it surely should not belong to you.

Thanks for your time."


20 mins later I get a response.

"Jin I apologize that this has taken so long. I dont check this email often as I have sold the company. I just sent a message to Umer the factory manager to find out what has happened with your suit. The best email to reach me at is (EMAIL REMOVED) as that is my normal email of use. I realize its taken forever but the new owner is aware of your suit being worked on as it was discussed. Next I stole no ones money so lets stop there before things are said that cannot be unsaid. Please email me at the email I listed here for further communication. I will get an answer out of umer as all payment was forwarded to them as was all of your sizing charts, design pattern and was to be drop shipped directly to you. Thank you.["

"Also if you wish to receive all funds back please have (Name removed) file a refund request for paypal and it will be processed. Thank you."



I reply:

"Scott,

As a consumer, you can't blame me for feeling a little more than frustrated. I understand your hands may be tied as well but I think you and I will agree that this is taking longer than we had both expected.

I understand there are faults in this process that were also largely attributed to my procrastination since I sent the design a month after the winning and changed the design afterwards. I apologize but the design was finalized and sent to you almost 3 months ago.

During this time period, all of your emails have been short and you had promised to give me an ETA 2 Mondays ago. I had not heard from you since (even after emailing you several times) and I thought you may have felt your obligations to your old company were no longer necessary.

I am not telling you this to place blame but for you to understand why I may have felt the way I had about this situation for that I apologize.


Here's what I can propose:

At this point, I need a suit by the 31st of this month as I will be attending a Racing School and a few weeks after that, I should be having my first race of the season. It is obvious that I will not make this deadline with a Lionheart suit.

If I got clearance from David, would you be willing to take the equity you had reserved to order the custom suit and put it towards a different suit of my choosing? I would also agree to donate another portion of that to the Wounded Warriors project.

I don't mean to offend anyone with this proposition but at this point, I'm starting the race season without something as essential as a suit. I feel that since you no longer run Lionheart Moto, you would not benefit from the marketing aspect of it.

Or, I don't mind waiting for the suit. I just need to know a time window so I can have a firm date as to when I can expect it so I can go ahead and buy another suit to keep me held over. I just felt like this would be the best case scenario.

Thanks"


Scott replies :

"At this point Kim im waiting on an email back from Umer. I was under the impression ot was mailed out not long ago and I apologize for not emailing you. The best bet is to have David request a refund via paypal and go that route. I will continue to reach out to Umer for an answer."



I replied:

"Hey Scott,


Although at this point, it would be a better step for me to have the Lionheart suit, I don't forsee that happening in a reasonable time frame.

I spoke to David about the proposition. He doesn't see an issue with the refund but he doesn't see why he has to play the middle man as any future issues would be routed through him.

He suggested just refunding me directly. It is no issue for me to do so and don't want to put anyone in a bind. Again, I plan on donating a percentage to the Wounded Warrior project. Let me know how we should resolve this."


Scott replies :

"I just spoke to (NAME REMOVED). If the factory doesnt answer me in a couple days he will request the funds back via paypal. thank you."



2/8/14

I wrote :

"Any word on the suit Scott? It's been a month since we spoke last. Still waiting on a response."


He replies :

"as i told you in the last email. I gave (Name removed) instructions to recoup the money and told him if he had not heard from me in a couple days to go for it...he said okay. I can get no response out of the factory, apparently they are unhappy with me selling the company...so get with (NAME REMOVED)again and tell him to charge back the money and bam your reimbursed. have a nice night."


I message "NAME REMOVED" (We'll call him Bob) since he was in charge of the raffle despite not being a part of it.

I feel terrible since Bob isn't involved and had to have Bob relocate the PayPal transactions since that's the way Scott wanted to do the refund.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 · (Edited)
I've been speaking with Bob since January.

Bob had finally located the transaction and sent in the refund request on 2/8/15.

Still no response from Scott. Obviously dodging me now since I don't think it takes 2 weeks to hit "REFUND" on PayPal.

He now owns a business called HARDSHELLTACTICAL.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
After this was posted, I sent:

"Scott,

I know you requested to deal with "Bob" from here on out but I'd like to send you one more email.

I have a lot of forum members asking me where my suit is. Unfortunately, I have nothing to tell them or show them.

I'm emailing you to let you know that I will need to go public with our issue.

I will be posting a thread on ZX6R.com, Facebook, and every bike forum. Everything said will be posted as fact and will be kept mature.

I've done everything you had requested including getting Bob involved despite his reluctancy. He requested the refund you told him to do weeks ago.

At this point, I've exhausted all my options. I can tell you're upset at me for accusing you of being a scammer but if you put yourself in my shoes, can you blame me?

Best of luck to you."





He replied :

"i spoke to david today. the factory f***** me over and isnt responding so i am tsking a refund out of my personal bank acct when my taxes hit which are due in the 23rd. so go as public as you want. i dont even own lionheart anymore havent for several months...so whe i get my taxes in ill habdle what needs to be done and until then have a good one."



I wish I can believe him but I've been strung along for months with promises of "in a few days".

Although I threatened litigation, no intelligent person would pursue someone out of state for a thousand dollars. I guess I'm stuck doing this lol. I've already chalked it up as a loss.
 

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This dude is a fucking asshat. I spoke with him personally on the phone and he was over flowing with confidence on how great this contest would be, how Corvus/the zx6r Facebook page would work with him/us, and how x.xx$ would be donated to fucking wounded warriors. I usually go out of way to support and vouch for vets, but this crap is a slap in the face. Best of luck dude, the "new owner" of lion heart seems to be dead set of improving the shitty reputation Scott has acquired, maybe you should message him for the suit.
 

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Well, it sort of sucks that the forum was involved although they are not responsible for this guy Scott F'ing you over. Seriously, a ton of people send in money and the guy makes off with the money for 7 months, ignores emails, and then blocks the winner? That's messed up to the Nth degree and then tries to play the victim.
 

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I thought that raffle sounded sketchy...I'm sorry you are going through all this. If I recall when we all did the math, the money they took in from the raffle was more than enough to buy a suit outright
 

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Just went back and read the original thread. I vaguely remember something like this at some point, but didn't remember all those details.

What do you have in writing?
 

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OH man.... some of the chatter in the original thread is pretty hindsight-humorous... or maybe just sad in retrospect.

you've dealt with Scott before. He's a standup guy and he wouldn't scam some people over a few bucks and ruin his reputation..
For fucks sake, it's $15 and the owner of the company has cosigned on it! I really don't care about what anyone thinks about the forum, FB, Corvus, or my dear aunt sally, I just want a new suit (potentially).
Perfectly legitimate sentiments, and good reasons to trust the contest, and yet...

It's a shame that NOTHING is trustworthy anymore. :-/

EDIT: Just got to pg 4. Nevermind. This thing was doomed from the beginning.
 

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Jeez, this whole thing is a complete disaster. Unfortunately for the new owner, I can't imagine going through Lionheart Moto for anything now even though I know Scott is out of the picture. And I certainly won't be looking to do business with Hardshell Tactical...ever :O

Sorry to hear about all this shit happening - almost makes me glad I didn't win the raffle now tho...

Although I threatened litigation, no intelligent person would pursue someone out of state for a thousand dollars.
This is unfortunately very true, I'm sure...there's just about no way that would end up working out well for you.

EDIT: Now that I'm thinking about it, do we have any reasonable proof that our money was actually donated to Wounded Warrior Project? I'd gladly put in some effort to make his life uncomfortable if it turns out that he didn't actually make any donation!
 

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Wow, I don't think Scott or hard shell tactical will be getting any $$ from me or any of my buddies. I'll make sure to spread the word on my end.

Sorry OP, really hope something works out for you.
 

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I certainly wouldn't be waiting. I would get a suit from somewhere else ASAP so you can go to your school and race. If, by some miracle you do end up getting the suit you'll have a spare or could sell one. If it's not generic then make sure the one you buy now is so you have a better chance of selling that one. The world would be a much better place if scammers/thieves like this could be replaced with upstanding/responsible people.
 

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Good luck, and I mean that sincerely. My teammate had to go through his credit card to get a refund for the suit he bought through LHM that took A YEAR to get and then was completely wrong, they wouldnt issue a refund.

Thankfully, the CC card company did the right thing although I am sure the dirtbags at LHM got off scott free as the company changed hands.
 

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Damn man sorry to hear it flopped like this. I was genuinely pumped that you should've got the suit. And to know he took the cash and flaked on the contest is bs. Glad I am not Scott I wouldn't want that kind of karma on me.
 

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OH man.... some of the chatter in the original thread is pretty hindsight-humorous... or maybe just sad in retrospect.





Perfectly legitimate sentiments, and good reasons to trust the contest, and yet...

It's a shame that NOTHING is trustworthy anymore. :-/

EDIT: Just got to pg 4. Nevermind. This thing was doomed from the beginning.
Hey I know that quote...

This hobby is expensive. It is starting to get annoying that there are a few of these pop up leather companies that aren't worth a damn.

Make sure you cross post over on "Trackday Junkies" as another one of these popups just got called out recently as well.
 

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Good luck, and I mean that sincerely. My teammate had to go through his credit card to get a refund for the suit he bought through LHM that took A YEAR to get and then was completely wrong, they wouldnt issue a refund.

Thankfully, the CC card company did the right thing although I am sure the dirtbags at LHM got off scott free as the company changed hands.
I see what you did there
 
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