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Nice. Definitely holding it for a few seconds longer in the 2nd video.

Im assuming you have changed your sprockets to help u wheelie?
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Nice. Definitely holding it for a few seconds longer in the 2nd video.

Im assuming you have changed your sprockets to help u wheelie?
Yeah man. On the second video I think I am actually getting a feel for Balance point. It started to feel weightless a bit and I definitely brought the front end up higher than the first time I was trying clutch ups. I have a feeling next time I go out I should be able to hold them out much longer and bring em up higher.

I went +11 in the rear so thats a 54 tooth rear sprocket lol.

I'm only posting up videos because Rj2112 always asked me to post up some vids. I know they aren't the best footage but I am on my journey to become a stunter. I will post more videos as I progress
 

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Definitely more time on one wheel in the second video....

Not being a stunter, Having only experienced wheelies on dirt bikes well before you were born it seems like doing them from a standing start would make it tougher to learn. You're trying to do quite a few things at nearly the same time, which require different actions to control them.

Just seems like spreading out the different steps would make it easier to learn each part.

Getting the wheel up, then keeping it up (balance point), and doing both at low speed seems like at least three things happening together.

I recall power wheelies in my youth that could go on for hundreds of feet, because I wasn't chasing a balancing point. I realize now, that it would have been easy to do, simply by shifting my weight further back.

Trying to learn that, with an upper speed limit complicates things.

You seem to initiate the wheelies pretty well, but end up chopping the throttle to control your speed, which drops the front.

My uninformed suggestion would be to let your speed increase and just concentrate on the balance point. Can't tell how big your playground is, but it looks pretty large.... If you have the room, use all of it.

Once you have the feel of the balance point, THEN work on doing it at lower speed.

Loft the front, get to balance point, maintain. Once you get to maintain, forward speed becomes less important.
 

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To touch on something RJ says above:

I don't stunt nor do I have any wish to try it. But I do appreciate those that can do it, AND take the time to properly learn how to! So props to you!

Question: Have you increased your idle speed? I know many stunters are leaving their idle up around 3k or so in some cases because it helps with allowing the front end to stay up a bit easier when you have to shut off throttle. I agree that you're probably (like me) a little freaked out when the wheel comes up that high, and letting off (a bit too much) throttle to keep the wheel in the air.

Just something I thought of while watching your video without the sound on :D
 

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To touch on something RJ says above:

I don't stunt nor do I have any wish to try it. But I do appreciate those that can do it, AND take the time to properly learn how to! So props to you!

Question: Have you increased your idle speed? I know many stunters are leaving their idle up around 3k or so in some cases because it helps with allowing the front end to stay up a bit easier when you have to shut off throttle. I agree that you're probably (like me) a little freaked out when the wheel comes up that high, and letting off (a bit too much) throttle to keep the wheel in the air.

Just something I thought of while watching your video without the sound on :D
I think you can see (and hear) him increasing his idle at the beginning of each video.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Yeah I raise my idle to 3k. I am still in the learning process at the moment but I progress each day I do go out.

I need to stop being a pussy and keep on the throttle lol. I am gettting closer to balance point. It feels like the bike is weightless the higher I go, so I need to start learning to tap the rear brake if I ever go too far back. I will be posting more vids on my progress on this thread. Thanks for watching and giving me some tips!
 

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Yeah I raise my idle to 3k. I am still in the learning process at the moment but I progress each day I do go out.

I need to stop being a pussy and keep on the throttle lol. I am gettting closer to balance point. It feels like the bike is weightless the higher I go, so I need to start learning to tap the rear brake if I ever go too far back. I will be posting more vids on my progress on this thread. Thanks for watching and giving me some tips!
The feeling that you are near the balance point is hard to isolate, when you are trying to do it slowly..... much easier to control it with smaller throttle movements, which I have to think are easier when you have some speed on the bike. Trying to adjust 5-10% is a whole lot less involved, when that change is 90 to 80%, rather than 15 to 5%. The 3K idle speed helps to 'fill in' the uneven power delivery at small throttle settings, but it's much, much more uniform higher in RPM. A world of difference up above 6-8K, compared to 2-3K.

I also think the tipping point is much more vertical than what it feels like from the seat of the bike. Seems to me that your body position needs to be further back on the frame to make it easier to get the nose up. Get your arse all the way back over the passenger section. I'd consider actually sitting on the passenger section, to get that position into your muscle memory.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I'll be installing handbrake kit sometime soon after I get my scrape bar on. And I will be working on getting up to balance point faster.

Keep posted. I will share my next video here on this thread. Thanks guys! 😄
 

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I think you can see (and hear) him increasing his idle at the beginning of each video.
did you not read that I was watching the video without sound? (I don't always have my speakers plugged in to hear stuff on my PC) Which is why I stated such... :p
 

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I'll be installing handbrake kit sometime soon after I get my scrape bar on. And I will be working on getting up to balance point faster.

Keep posted. I will share my next video here on this thread. Thanks guys! 😄
I say that you don't need to worry about how fast you get to the balance point, until you can consistently get there. Chase the wheelie for a while, rather than specifically trying for balance point. I'm willing to bet that you'll have a much better feel for it, when you can keep the front off the ground for 10 seconds or more.

When you feel it come up, leave the throttle at the same point, and let the bike decide how high it's going..... As it speeds up, the front will start to drop, so you can think of it as a natural limiter for height. Learn how to land it softly, rather than letting it slam back to earth.

Once you're comfortable with 'this much throttle = this high (max) in xx seconds', THEN work on moving your weight further back on the bike. That will translate to higher front, for the same throttle, in roughly the same time. You can work on different aspects of the wheelie, one at a time.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Yes I think that might work. Are there any other active stunters here on this forum that can give me some tips?
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Quick update: I still suck

I managed to have some time to hit the lot and practice today. Overall, I think I did much worse that previous sessions. I might be a little rusty and I'm still getting a feel for wheelies. Anyways, here what I got in today
 

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I would say that you aren't using the bike's power band, at all. Too low in RPM overall, and probably trying from too low a starting speed. 5 MPH into a 10 MPH wheelie is not an easy thing. A 20 MPH starting speed, with the wheelie bringing you up to 30 MPH -- that's IMHO a much easier thing to control, because the timing of it is far, far less critical. More time to adjust what you're doing between the stages of the wheelie. You seem to be trying to stop the nose from coming up earlier than is possible, if you want to balance the bike on the back tire. As soon as the nose comes up, you seem to cut the throttle to try and slow how fast it's coming up. At the very least, you need to hold the throttle constant, and likely need to give it a bigger kick in the pants to bring the nose where you want it to be.

Balance is going to be with the chassis at something like 60° or more, depending on how far off the seat you are willing to extend your body's mass. I doubt that you achieved more than 45°, probably more like 40 in the first half of the video I watched.

Please understand, no criticism is intended. Just describing the physics and where I think your bike and body are at compared to what you have said your goal is.

Low RPM = Low inconsistent power delivery. I would think it would be a lot easier to work with the motor to control chassis position if it were turning 6K or more. Up there, the amount you twist delivers a much more consistent change in power output. 8K even more power, smoother delivery.... ask for more get more, rather than ask, ask, ask, BANG.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Yes I understand what you are saying. But, in the world of stunting best way to learn control and balance point is to start a wheelie from almost dead stop. That way you wouldnt be up high in rpms and chasing out a wheelie.

I do admit however that I am being a pussy when the wheel comes up and I let off the throttle. Over time I will get over that fear and eventually bring it up balance point from a dead stop and learn slow "idle" wheelies.

I went out today for about an hour of practice. I got some progress and will post the very short video soon. Thanks! 🤘
 

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Yeah I raise my idle to 3k. I am still in the learning process at the moment but I progress each day I do go out.

I need to stop being a pussy and keep on the throttle lol. I am gettting closer to balance point. It feels like the bike is weightless the higher I go, so I need to start learning to tap the rear brake if I ever go too far back. I will be posting more vids on my progress on this thread. Thanks for watching and giving me some tips!
Watching your vids I can tell you're definitely chopping the throttle. Youre clutching them up pretty good but then kinda pussing out lol. Thats pretty natural and youll get use to it over time. If you wanna accelerate progress you can bump your idle up even further to 3.5 or even 4k. Its like autopilot for wheelies. Cant chop the throttle if the default throttle setting is faster than your current speed haha. That actually works great for learning and once you get better youll really like it set higher as it enables you to do more advanced tricks. No handers or no throttle hander wheelies you need your idle high so that the bike is constantly accelerating a little and then all you need to modulate is the rear brake with the foot, no throttle hand required. In any case I would suggest start practicing tapping the rear brake even if youre no where near the balance point. Its good to get a feel for it and develop that muscle memory so that when you are actually beyond the BP and in need of coming back down it isnt the first time youre trying to use it.

I'll be installing handbrake kit sometime soon after I get my scrape bar on. And I will be working on getting up to balance point faster.

Keep posted. I will share my next video here on this thread. Thanks guys! 😄
What are you getting for a scrape bar? I recommend a round bar over a flat bar. Flat bars the corner tends to dig in to the pavement if youre not totally perpendicular to the ground when it scrapes and can wind up chucking you one way or the other. Round bars a little more forgiving that way. Round bar also has less jagged edges to skewer you when you eventually fuck up lol. And speaking of fucking up, have you crashed yet? That thing looks pretty minty still. If youre gonna crank the idle to 4k youll learn balance point wheelies in one afternoon but youll 12oclock hit and go over several times in the process. I would even suggest taking off the nice looking plastics for a while until youre more confident. Even though you have the cage on they still get right fucked when you crash.

In terms of handbrake I would suggest holding off until youve mastered the basic wheelies first like sitdowns, staggered standups and foot in seat stand ups. You dont really need the handbrake until youre doing more advanced things where your right foot isnt on the rearset to access the rear brake like seat standers, double back pegs, spreaders, high chair, ralph louis etc. For now the handbrake is just one more thing thats gonna snap off and break when you crash. And definitely dont get one of those junction types handbrakes they suck and feel horrible. I got one of them for my first handbrake and wound up hating it. Get a bracket with a dedicated handbrake caliper once youre ready to move on to those other tricks i mentioned earlier.

Another thing that really helped me at your stage was dropping the rear tire pressure. Like literally 8 PSI so it looks like its flat. I wouldnt advise driving home from the lot when its that low but it virtually eliminates having to balance side-side and lets you focus purely on the up-down balance point. Pretty much locked in on a straight line. Of course once you get the hang of BP then start filing up the tire more because youll want to be able to steer your wheelies. Also try going a little slower when you clutch it. Like literally a dead stop or pretty damn close to one. The slower youre going the less it hurts when you get bucked. Did i mention you'll eventually get bucked? Dozens and dozens of times over and over again lol so get use to it.



I would say that you aren't using the bike's power band, at all. Too low in RPM overall, and probably trying from too low a starting speed. 5 MPH into a 10 MPH wheelie is not an easy thing. A 20 MPH starting speed, with the wheelie bringing you up to 30 MPH -- that's IMHO a much easier thing to control, because the timing of it is far, far less critical. More time to adjust what you're doing between the stages of the wheelie. You seem to be trying to stop the nose from coming up earlier than is possible, if you want to balance the bike on the back tire. As soon as the nose comes up, you seem to cut the throttle to try and slow how fast it's coming up. At the very least, you need to hold the throttle constant, and likely need to give it a bigger kick in the pants to bring the nose where you want it to be.

Balance is going to be with the chassis at something like 60° or more, depending on how far off the seat you are willing to extend your body's mass. I doubt that you achieved more than 45°, probably more like 40 in the first half of the video I watched.

Please understand, no criticism is intended. Just describing the physics and where I think your bike and body are at compared to what you have said your goal is.

Low RPM = Low inconsistent power delivery. I would think it would be a lot easier to work with the motor to control chassis position if it were turning 6K or more. Up there, the amount you twist delivers a much more consistent change in power output. 8K even more power, smoother delivery.... ask for more get more, rather than ask, ask, ask, BANG.
His rear sprockets the size of a medium pizza. The powerband is at 5mph and redline is at 25 lol
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Thanks for the advice man. Yeah I'm definitely chopping the throttle for sure. I am still working on keeping on the throttle after I clutch it up. Also, I am tapping the rear brake but I am no where near balance point yet.

I am going to get a scrape bar and subframe from a town customs.
 
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