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‘12 Zx6r does not turn over but bump starts

4K views 39 replies 10 participants last post by  RJ2112 
#1 · (Edited)
Issue began months ago when I replaced the stator but was told I didn’t put enough loctite on the screws. I had been riding quite a while until one evening I was heading downtown, and i proceeded to warm my bike up like I usually do; all of a sudden, the bike kicks off. I engaged the start button several times, no dice. Turned over until I lost battery power. I bump start... push in neutral, get up to speed, put in 1st and give gas while letting of the clutch. Acted like it wanted to start, but cuts back off. Several attempts after recharging the battery, no dice. Over the course of several months, I tried almost everything aside from replacing the engine. Replaced starter... it turned over but didn’t start. I replaced battery, replaced voltage regulator, replaced spark plugs, replaced starter clutch (all gears). Still turned over but no dice. Then it stopped turning over altogether. I gave up and took to my neighborhood mechanic. He has it for two weeks. Tested both sides of the engine and the top end. He found the screws loosed and shaved from contact of the magneto. He replaced and put loctite and all. But he says he tested the starter which was within spec. Spark plug gaps were out of spec, he put back to spec. He tested battery under load, within spec. He says, he used slightly higher voltage, but still wouldn’t turn over. Checked cam chain and all associated parts. All within spec. Checked coil also, within spec. Voltage between switch and starter also within spec. He recommended a rebuild.

All that was in Houston. I live in Baltimore now. After my move, I bump started the bike and that’s how I’ve figured out that it bump starts without skipping a beat. I rode through all gears, but still won’t start with the switch. I get the priming sound (clicks), and it idles regular after starting, but outside of that I need haaaalp because the starter button won’t turn it over. I bought some liqui moly engine flush, but I don’t want to dump it in there and find out I’ve wasted 50 bucks flushing and putting in new oil for no reason.

I don’t know what else to do and I don’t want to get taken to the cleaners by a shop over something I know I am capable of fixing. Any ideas?
 
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#4 ·
Did you replace the starter solenoid, too? That’s the internal “switch” that your starter button activates to connect the battery to the starter motor, which then turns over the engine.

If your battery voltage is good, and the voltage at the battery goes up when the engine is running and reved, then the charging system should be good. That would then make it a problem of delivering the electricity to the starter motor, which would be either the starter switch itself, or the starter solenoid. Like RJ said - check all the fuses too.
 
#5 ·
Did you replace the starter solenoid, too? That’s the internal “switch” that your starter button activates to connect the battery to the starter motor, which then turns over the engine.



If your battery voltage is good, and the voltage at the battery goes up when the engine is running and reved, then the charging system should be good. That would then make it a problem of delivering the electricity to the starter motor, which would be either the starter switch itself, or the starter solenoid. Like RJ said - check all the fuses too.


No, the starter solenoid has not been replaced. But the mechanic said it was tested also. I checked all fuses. None were popped. If the starter switch were bad, would it still click and activate the fuel pump prime?


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#11 ·
I would recommend checking the little switch on the clutch lever and also the switch on the kick stand. If they aren't working properly the it won't even try to turn over in certain circumstances (i.e. in gear and kickstand down or in gear and the clutch lever not pulled in).
 
#15 · (Edited)
He recommended a rebuild.
I wouldn't trust a mechanic that recommended a rebuild for something that is pretty clearly an electrical issue. Since the bike bump starts OK your problems lie somewhere in the starter system and nowhere else.


I personally can’t see that “engine flush” being of any benefit in your situation.
+1.

Shards of metal floating around in the oil.
The magneto shredded the bolts that came undone from the stator.
In that case you need to do an oil change. For the price of a jug of oil and filter it is cheap insurance to get the crap out.


No, the starter solenoid has not been replaced. But the mechanic said it was tested also.
Since he may not have been that useful, try jumping the poles on the starter solenoid with a screwdriver. If it starts then your solenoid is bad. If that doesn't appeal to you, take a multimeter and check that you have 12V on the battery side post of the solenoid, then check that you have 12V on the starter side post of the solenoid when the starter button is pushed. If that is OK then I would be checking the starter button itself to be sure it is working properly. Take it apart, clean it and try again.


Mark
 
#18 ·
I wouldn't trust a mechanic that recommended a rebuild for something that is pretty clearly an electrical issue. Since the bike bump starts OK your problems lie somewhere in the starter system and nowhere else.









+1.











In that case you need to do an oil change. For the price of a jug of oil and filter it is cheap insurance to get the crap out.









Since he may not have been that useful, try jumping the poles on the starter solenoid with a screwdriver. If it starts then your solenoid is bad. If that doesn't appeal to you, take a multimeter and check that you have 12V on the battery side post of the solenoid, then check that you have 12V on the starter side post of the solenoid when the starter button is pushed. If that is OK then I would be checking the starter button itself to be sure it is working properly. Take it apart, clean it and try again.





Mark


I jumped the solenoid. I used a 10mm wrench, and then bottle nose pliers. Nothing. No spark.
 
#17 ·
starter solenoid?
clutch safety switch?
not in nuetral?
starter button or wiring from it to the solenoid?
bad starter?
hell it could even be a bad connection on the bottom of the ignition switch itself

tons of easy ways to test most of these and all of it is free.........


you can jump the poles on the solenoid
you can apply direct 12v to the starter itself
you can bypass the clutch safety switch
 
#20 ·
Ok. So I tested the old solenoid. I used the negative from the battery and the positive on the battery first. Registered 13v. Even after trying to turn over. Still no turn over. Remains. 13, 12.9v. I switched the positive to the solenoid. The voltage dropped to 7v. I turned the bike off. Turned it back on. It showed 12.9v. I changed the solenoid. Now it does the same thing. Only difference is after trying to start it, it’s at the 12.9v rather than 7v with the old solenoid. Still clicking and not turning over. Halp!


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#24 ·
That's not too far away, I'm close to Elkridge. You need to follow the factory service manual and follow the flow of electrical power. Or if you get ready to lite it on fire, don't, and sell it to me. :D
 
#25 ·
Alright dude. This is a simple circuit that shouldnt have taken this long to figure out.

Im not sure if u know how a solenoid works, but think of it as a valve. U have constant power on one side. When the valve opens, it lets the power pass through to the other side.

Here is your solenoid:



Grab your multimeter. Install the solenoid and hook up the cables/wiring like its supposed to be. But do not connect the cable on the M side.

Check for power at the B terminal. It should read about 12v at all times.

Turn on your key. Press and hold the starter button. Solenoid should click.

Check for power at the M terminal now. What is it?
 
#27 ·
Alright dude. This is a simple circuit that shouldnt have taken this long to figure out.



Im not sure if u know how a solenoid works, but think of it as a valve. U have constant power on one side. When the valve opens, it lets the power pass through to the other side.



Here is your solenoid:







Grab your multimeter. Install the solenoid and hook up the cables/wiring like its supposed to be. But do not connect the cable on the M side.



Check for power at the B terminal. It should read about 12v at all times.



Turn on your key. Press and hold the starter button. Solenoid should click.



Check for power at the M terminal now. What is it?


12.7 V


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#26 ·
I don't think I've ever seen a thread get this long when it's such a simple ass problem. :O

OP needs a class in basic electrical and how to use a basic tester and multimeter.
 
#29 ·
O I redid these tests just now. Disconnecting M and testing individually. I don’t get a constant 12 there. It only gives 12.7 when the start button is pressed. When I connect the starter end, same thing on starter, no voltage until i apply the start button... Once applied, I get 11.2v on the starter, click, and engine doesn’t turn over.


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#34 ·
O I redid these tests just now. Disconnecting M and testing individually. I don’t get a constant 12 there. It only gives 12.7 when the start button is pressed. When I connect the starter end, same thing on starter, no voltage until i apply the start button... Once applied, I get 11.2v on the starter, click, and engine doesn’t turn over.
Well sounds like everything is working like it should. If the starter is getting 12v but not turning, then its bad.

The only other thing that would keep the starter from turning is a seized engine, but u said the bike can be bump-started so thats not the case.

Take the starter back and get a replacement.
 
#32 ·
Inspect the ends of the cables, and the electrical connections. Make sure everything is clean and free of corrosion. Check the ground connections, especially. Current cannot flow (& work cannot be done) unless there is a complete path all the way to and from the battery. Rust has resistance and limits current flow.

If you have all new components, the wiring has to be suspect.

The alternative hypothesis --- how good is your battery?
 
#36 ·
Inspect the ends of the cables, and the electrical connections. Make sure everything is clean and free of corrosion. Check the ground connections, especially. Current cannot flow (& work cannot be done) unless there is a complete path all the way to and from the battery. Rust has resistance and limits current flow.



If you have all new components, the wiring has to be suspect.



The alternative hypothesis --- how good is your battery?


The battery is brand new from Walmart... basically returned for credit and got a new one. Refilled and recharged gel.


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#33 ·
I’ve heard of starter motors rotating in such a way that they get “stuck” in position, but once turned a bit they work just fine again. This even happened to the electric motor in the dryer in my laundry! Wouldn’t start running again until I manually moved the motor by hand spinning the dryer drum.
 
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